Rox,

No, that was cool to hear, not at all preachy.

As for Otter Creek- they've yet to really impress me, though I do think some of the Wolavers beers are pretty good. The other Magic Hat to try (maybe this was what you meant?) is St. Gootz- it's a drak wheat and mighty tasty. Actually Magic Hat made a good decision with their mixed-cases, which have the downside of forcing me to drink 3(!) #9's but on the upside, always comes with 3 of their new Mystery Beers. I just like that a Co. has the guts to throw their experiments out there for consideration.

All that said... NY has a much broader selection of quality beers than VT. I guess size does matter after all.

Have a beery weekend!

Pauldub,

I realized last night when I was pulling a beer from the 'fridge, that I had the wrong name. The beer from Magic Hat that I was referring to was Circus Boy not Hop Sun.

BR

Further, I am presently drinking Paulaner hefe-weisbier and Judas Blonde (Belgian). It sounds like you are looking for a summer beer with some spine, if so, these two will do. Cheers

I started out drinking Carling black label and Schlitz. Not the bst, but that's what we could sneak out of my friends fridge 35 years ago. Took a loonngg time to get over that. I figure with the variety out there now, it's gotta be getting good out there.

Don't worry, Joaquim-

I drink myriad styles, I just covered these three for this review. Note that I discussed Franziskanner in my last review, Berliner Kindl Weisse in this one, and Magic Hat's Circus Boy was also subtly referenced in this one, so I'm no stranger to beers "with spine."

As for the lime in Pacifico- tradition or not, I think it tastes nice. And, I have been served many a bucket of Pacifico splits on the beach in Mazatlan- they always come with limes (but you certainly don't have to use them.)

eac, I had a Circus Boy at Colter Bay the other night based on your recommendation. I loved it! I'm looking for a six pack to keep in the fridge o' beer.

I am anxious to try the Flying Biison Buffalo Lager....but......I still believe that the german Wahrsteiner is the standard against which all other lagers are measured !!!

pauldub-

At Mr. Goodbar, you might have liked Gaffel Kolsch, just off the top of my head.

You might consider their GoodBeer Club, too- the next meeting should be Aug 9th.

Si, si carnal, because you're a gringo. They'll serve wine with lime for los Americanos.

Ethan,

If you haven't read Steve Powell's Rushing the Growler, I'd suggest you do so. It is a great read on Buffalo's brewing history. From what I've read there and elsewhere, Schlitz and Pabst Breweries started putting smaller breweries out of business long before Miller and A-B got in the game. They dumped their beer in other markets at low or below cost to knock out the local competition. Ironic that both couldn't survive. Since the market share of the major breweries have been stagnant for years, I suspect that their massive marketing budgets aren't keeping pace. A-B has recently announced that they may be forced to rethink their business plan due to their lack of growth and start entering alternative markets. I wonder if they should just dust off a pre-prohibition recipe and brew a true king of beers.

They'll serve wine with lime for los Americanos.

Now that's gross- and I'm not even a wine guy.

Anyway, tradition- if we never broke from it, we'd have some pretty limited beer choices, I have to say. Some people say it is traditional to put a lemon in a hefe-weisse, too, but I skip it. Personal taste trumps tradition in my book any day.

Paul, for the record...I was just hoping to knock back a few beers of any kind with you!

Personally, I think Corona almost begs for a lime, and Pacifico has a raher weak taste, much like a Coors, and a lime can only add some zing. I prefer the Modelos and Bohemia from Mexico. Both should be drunk without a lime. I'd prefer a Buffalo brewed lager over that non-native one that invaded and took over from another former steel town, now if only the local bars and stores will take to it like they have to Yeungling.

Unfiltered... and unfettered!

I'm with you- I sort of avoided Magic Hat for a while because their flagship (#9) isn't really to my liking. But I have to say, just about every other beer of theirs I've had is rip-roaring good. They offer a filtered version of the Circus Boy- Hocus Pocus- that's sort of a yawn once you've had The Boy.

Long Trail is also a mighty fine brewer... hey, did you ever have Catamount? They were great! Didn't manage their growth well and collapsed, but man did I ever like their beers.

Consumers on Elmwood and the one way the hell up Transit both have growler stations, but, technically, I didn't say that (not in Buffalo, don't want to get yelled at here ;) )

And yeah... the AB reserve beers I've had were better, but not a lot. Still, A-B is definitely looking to snap-up players in the only growth segment of the market- microbrews- so watch out. Someday soon, Sierra Nevada or someone of equal stature will be picked up by them, or SAB-Miller, or Molson-Coors, or Heineken... you know it. Maybe Sam Adams will beat 'em to it, though- I could live with that.

Corona and Pacifico are both made by the same company,Grupo Modelo, and are very similar in flavor, imo with Pacifico being lighter in body.. As for lime being appropriate or not, outside of a michelada, any lime in the beer is a European invention, and as such not "Mexican" for whatever that means. It's true that Corona was the first to be marketed as being served with lime, but it's also true that this was a gimmick for Europe.

Corona has a lighter feel and a slightly more bitter taste. Pacifico is more filling (carbonated, flavor) and does not lend itself to being drunk by the bucket load a la Corona. Also, Pacifico is traditionally served sans lime. Cheers.

Sancho, Thank you for the Wikipedia copy & paste treatment. I should have been specific with my reference to the Modelos. I meant Negra Modelo, and to a lesser extent, Modelo Especial. I think Pacifico is as similar to Corona as Bud Light is to Michelob (same manufacturers). There are distinct flavor and carbonation variations between these beers.

Pauldub,

Drink what you like. Anyone who gets all uppity about American/Canadian mass beers and those people who tell you what is good and what isn't can f**k themselves IMO. Seems like beer snobs are getting worse and worse. Keep trying different styles and brewers of beers to see what you like. My guess is that the more you try the more you'll like the variety that is out there between imports and craft brewers. Want something a bit different than a Blue or a Canadian for a hot summer day without getting too full bodied? Try a Pilsner Urquell. Pilsner Urquell has a pleasant taste without being full-bodied. American and Canadian pilsner's are derivations of this pilsner from the Czech Republic. I think they can be found at Consumer's or Premier Gourmet. Also, Magic Hat Brewing Co from Burlington, VT makes an outstanding summer wheat beer called Hop Sun. I found a 6 at Frontier Liquor on Grant Street but think I have also seen it at Wilson Farms. Unlike Ethan, I love dropping a lemon into a summer wheat beer. It cuts the otherwise yeasty taste and results in a crisp refreshing beer that is totally thirst-quenching. Buffalo Lager is an outstanding beer but is more full bodied than either of the above. My Grandfather (who is in his late 80s) said that Buffalo Lager tastes like the beer he remembers from growing up.

As for Buffalo Lager, the good folks at Flying Bison told me a couple of weeks ago that you can only get the Lager on tap at the Buffalo Brew Pub or at their brewery. The bottles are distributed along with their others - Aviator Red and Barnstormer Pale Ale.

Ethan gives great reviews on BRO of beers to try (often teasing with beers that are not available locally).

Bottoms up.

I'm sorry, is it frowned upon to use actual sources when making assertions? I guess since I used a Spanish name I am just as much of an expert as you, and don't need to verify my facts. Maybe I should mix in terms like gringo, guero, or even vato. That will make it so legit I don't even need to check facts, and can safely claim whatever I want.

If all you can say about my comments is that they are buttressed by a respected source, what does that tell you? You're attempting to cast aspersions on my claims by linking them to wikipedia, but look how ridiculous that is.

My only point was that all limes in beer, aside from the michelada which is lime juice anyway, are European marketing gimmicks so you can't really say one belongs and one does not according to a sense of tradition.

fwiw- I did discuss the joys of Pilsner Urquell in the last news/review. Easily one of my favorite beers. But it most certainly has a lot of hop character compared to Blue or Canadian!

As for the BudMillerCoors "axis of evil," well... my objections to them are really twofold. First, I do think they make relatively uninteresting products, overall- rice and corn are used expressly to add fermentables at little cost and with little flavor. Taste is subjective, though, so it's hard to be too too critical in that respect. And one does have to marvel at the consistency.

More problematic for me, though, is their market dominance, which long squelched the diversity we enjoy today. I don't believe that most of their adherents have sampled widely and come to the conclusion that this is really their favorite beer. I think most BudMillerCoors drinkers just drink it because they always have, because their friends do, because of their amazing marketing and pricing advantage. And well- that's just not the best reason to drink a particular beer.

Sancho, 'Joaquim' is not a Spanish name. Maybe you should have wiki'd it. Wiki is hardly a respected source. As a matter of fact, it is under constant criticism for its content source and the validity of its open copy format. You didn't link your source, you plagiarised it. As a caveat, your respected source is currently flagged for disputed neutrality. Cast aspersions? It's a catchy clichE to be sure, but maybe you should 'Webster' that word. I was at most, sarcastic. I lived in Europe for several years and everything from water to coke, and in Rome, even some coffees are served with a citrus garnish, usually lemon. Coronitas in Spain and Italy are served with lemon. This has more to do with the history of the 'shandy' or 'clara' in these parts, which is beer mixed with lemon juice or lemon soda, which long predates Corona and Coronita. It will always be served with a lemon and not a lime. I have also lived in Mexico for a long, long, time, and yes, I may say that Pacifico is traditionally srved to Mexicans without a lime. Real world experience will trump anything you may copy and paste from the web. Maybe you get out some more, or at least enjoy a beer. Sounds like you can use one. Cheers

BuffaloRox-

Thanks for bringing up Stephen's book- it is a fantastic read (if you're into Buffalo, beer, & history, anyway), though I don't know exactly where one might pick up a copy- probably the Historical Society store has some, though.

Quite so that there were precursors to A-B, SAB-Miller, et al. I guess it's fairer to say that industry-wide consolidation generally limits choices, and so those guys are the current best exemplars.

The same thing is happening in Germany right now, which is why a unique beer like Berliner Kindl is really an 'endangered species.' Now, Custom Brewcrafters (and probably other American micros) are making a Berliner Weisse, which is admirable, but still not a good reason for Kindl to die.

I've had smaller reserve batches from A-B, though, that were definitely a cut above their normal products. I think a pre-pro recipe would be a great marketing decision, and it would also be something I'd like to try. Of course, since barley and hop varietals have also changed in the last 70 years, it might be hard to nail it, but they ought to give it a shot.

I think Tim & Co. down at Flying Bison would be thrilled to hear that about your grandfather's take on the new lager.

What difference does it make , how one likes his or her beer, or for that matter the origin of the method. Indulge in what ever tastes, smells or feels good, enjoyment is your privilege and can be individual, drink and eat well.

If everyone wants to do some more tasting and head-to-head comparisons, you should all stop at the Buffalo Brewfest in September being held at the Central Terminal. For more information check out buffalobrewfest.com (sites not complete yet but will be up soon).

I suppose it makes a difference depending on how serious you take it. Would you accept Robert Parker reviewing a bourdeaux whilst chewing Wrigley's?

B-Rox,

right: Hop Sun is from Southern Tier, and it's filtered.

Circus Boy is my current obsession. Have one on-tap at Colter Bay sometime (and if you've seen it on draft elsewhere--in the city--let me know!)

And what would you suggest for a rookie who enjoys an occasional blue or canadian, detests Guinness, and is looking for something different? I defer to the masters...

Ethan,

I'll have to swing by Colter Bay and see how Circus Boy is on tap. Despite living in Vermont for three years, I was never really a fan of Magic Hat (I prefer Long Trail). However, it takes quite a bit of will power not to keep knocking these back on a hot night! They are really crisp & refreshing. Now I'm really looking forward to getting out of work...

I really miss the old Gates Circle Beverage Center. You used to be able to fill up growlers of a number of CB's offerings. I think I've read that Consumer's Beverage on Elmwood in Tonawanda had multiple drafts available.

Last December, A-B put out a holiday pack for Michelob that included a couple of beers made only with malt, hops, water and yeast. Unfortunately, they were like starter sets for the A-B crowd. Neither very malty nor very hoppy.

Wow. Controversy at a beer post? I've finally arrived, I guess.

Pauldub: Have a Flying Bison Buffalo Lager- if it fails to satisfy, I'll throw another few ideas your way. It is going to have a bit more flavor than a Canadian or a Blue, but I think you'll dig it.

Think Local- Drink Local!

Ethan,

Catamount and Long Trail are stories of two breweries who had vastly different marketing plans. Catamount grew with the explosive growth of microbreweries in the early '90s. I believe that there beer was served at the White House for some occasion that slips my mind (maybe an inauguration?). They had a couple of good beers. Their porter was kick ass. They also had a true canadian style ale (the kind I remember stealing drinks of as a kid and before they started putting cheap fillers in). They seemed to want to spread their product far and wide like many microbrewers of that time. In contrast, Long Trail stopped distributing their beers outside of VT for a long time. They wanted to flood VT with their beers. In the end, Catamount never developed a deep following. They also sunk a ton of money into building a new brewery in Windsor, VT just as there was an oversupply of microbrews. Deadly combo. Right before they were acquired by Harpoon, they made some light flavorless beer to attract the A-B crowd (Starbright?). Obviously, a failure. I apologize if you already knew this. I didn't want to sound preachy, its just an interesting story of how two local brewers took different paths and the results.

I also dislike the other Vermont beer, Otter Creek. With so many good beers available, I won't buy their beers. That being said...I really don't like Hocus Pocus, Blind Faith, or #9. Fat Angel was okay. I haven't tried St. Gobains. However, since I like Circus Boy, maybe I'll give St. Gobains a try.

Glad its almost the weekend.

Yes you have. When I was sort of intimidated by the selection at Mr Goodbar on Monday, I just ordered Tonic. Geek looked at me like I was not right in the head.

You're right it is St. Gootz. I'll have to give it a try sometime.

However, this Saturday I'm off to Flying Bison to fill up my 5 gal. soda canister for some Buffalo Lager or Barnstormer Pale Ale on tap... Yum. $40 for 5 gal. What a deal for great beer!

Have a great weekend.